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VBBR
Moderator
Brazil
617 Posts |
 Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 2:13:47 PM
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Is it really needed to learn C++? I mean, for me to be a proffesional programmer. I started thinking that taking a close look at the direction Windows (and IT in general) are taking, C++ will be dead soon.
If it doesn't, still look at Windows. The next versions will be "heavily integrated with .NET" (Eric Coleman). So it doesn't matter if you use C#, VB.NET, J# or managed C++. All will be the same thing in the end.
C++ seems to me somewhat wrong for the current direction of IT. I think the .NET approach (unhappily it was M$') is more likely to succeed.
Well the main reason I started this topic for is the question: Is it really needed for me to learn a language that probably won't last for long? Remember, C++ is somewhat old and has its problems...
A little off-topic but just a little question: is it better for me to make HEX in VB6 or 2003? Does everyone here have the .NET framework 1.1? |
Whatever. Who knows... |
Edited by - VBBR on Apr 27 2004 2:20:19 PM
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EACam
Warrior
154 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 4:04:14 PM
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C++ old? Sure, that's why it's supposedly so great. But you're right, it does seem it'll die off soon, considering the easier languages are getting more and more powerful...but it'll never COMPLETELY die. There'll always be the good old timers who keep it alive.
Professional programming with VB? Sure! I know a guy who does programming in almost solely VB as his job (aka Profession :)! Although, you must realize that alot of the programming jobs are going off to third-world contries: India, for example. With the build up in the internet, passing info between contries is a breeze, and paying indians who live on rice and potatos is a whole lot cheaper than giving health insurance benefits to an American dude who's a member of a nasty union anyway. So if you really want a good programming job, learn some indian language and get on over to india. So you may be living in a shack, but at least you have a job! (unlike if you were in America, tho you'd probably be better off on wellfare without a job anyway ;)
just my 2-cents.
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VBBR
Moderator
Brazil
617 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 4:14:03 PM
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Yeah I also do a (small) job using VB and just VB. But still it's a job and remember I am relatively new with programming...
Just because sometimes you may need the low-level access of C++ and it's good to know the "main" language of the industry. But as .NET comes in, I really don't know if C++ will continue being the "lead" language.
(BTW I once saw a post on GDNet complaining that VB is worse than C++ just because it has a bunch of keywords... heck that's what makes VB so easy...) |
Whatever. Who knows... |
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sdw
Warrior
USA
160 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 5:14:13 PM
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| C++ won't die. If you want to become a professional programmer then you'll want to learn C/C++ because it's very popular, fast, and used in most professional games today. Doesn't .Net need a virtual machine like java in order to run, therefore making it much slower than C++? Not real sure I don't use .net |
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EACam
Warrior
154 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 5:19:55 PM
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.NET has not been proven to be much slower (if any) than traditional languages...at least as far as I know. So they present mainly benefits, not problems.
(But I'm still a VB 5.0 old timer  , i like 6.0 a lot better, but I wouldn't use .NET if you paid me........well......maybe) |
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sdw
Warrior
USA
160 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 5:56:33 PM
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Also, isn't .Net limited to windows only?
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VBBR
Moderator
Brazil
617 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 6:56:37 PM
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Hum, M$ says that ".NET programs will be running in any OS that has the .NET framework without any need of change in code".
But of course as long as M$ continues developing Windows this means Windows only.
(well, vb6 is also just win isn't it?)
Never hope for a .NET framework in Linux...
...that is, unless someone creates an un-official one!
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Whatever. Who knows... |
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Lachlan87
Moderator
USA
160 Posts |
Posted - Apr 27 2004 : 7:18:32 PM
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| I know of a group that is working on a version of the .Net runtimes for linux (I'll try to post the link later), but as far as I could tell, their version wouldn't support windows forms, so 99% of .Net code wouldn't even run. . . but then, I only glanced over the site. Maybe I was mistaken. |
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Lachlan87
Moderator
USA
160 Posts |
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Eric Coleman
Gladiator
USA
811 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2004 : 09:47:28 AM
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| C++ is the way to go for game programming. Windows is NOT the only gaming platforum. There is Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft's XBOX, which will be using the same processors used in Apple computers. You not only need to learn C++, but also ANSI C, Assembly, and know a lot of mathematics. |
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VBBR
Moderator
Brazil
617 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2004 : 10:54:51 AM
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Good that I like maths. 
Thanks for the point Eric, good remembering me that consoles also exist...
What is the usefullness of C? I think C++ is the "important" as yourself said... |
Whatever. Who knows... |
Edited by - VBBR on Apr 28 2004 11:44:18 AM |
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Dan
Squire
United Kingdom
29 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2004 : 1:17:18 PM
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.NET is OS independant, as long as the target machine has the framework installed. When a .net application is compiled from c# , vb or whatever - it is compiled down in to an intermeditate format - a middle ground - that requires final compilation on the target machine. Although an application can be set to compile during installation it's default operation is to recompile every time it runs, along with the bloat of the .net framework.
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VBBR
Moderator
Brazil
617 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2004 : 1:36:51 PM
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| That's what I said. The problem is that (currently) there isn't a (complete) framework for any OS other than Windows. |
Whatever. Who knows... |
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Eric Coleman
Gladiator
USA
811 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2004 : 3:52:14 PM
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You can't use the cross platform possibility of .NET as a reason for using it. First, there is no work being done by microsoft on Linux. Also, even if someone does create a .NET for Linux, then it will be so outdated that newer programs won't work on it at all. Look at the current schedule of .NET. Microsoft released .NET 2002, and then it released a newer version in 2003. If you rely on 3rd party companies for .NET support, then you'll end up using a version of .NET that works on windows but not on Linux. With Microsoft's new version of windows, the .NET framework will be upgraded yet once again, and any Linux port of the .NET runtimes will be severely outdated.
The other reason you can't expect your .NET game to run on Linux is that you'll probably end up using DirectX, and there is no version of DirectX for Linux. So even if you did create 1.0 .NET game, the fact that it uses directx makes it a Windows only program.
In reality, there is no such thing as "cross platform" .NET when it comes to game programming.
C++, on the other hand IS cross platform. C++ has compilers for every conceivable operating system, so if you use C++ (Not Visual C++), then you can have some reasonable cross platform code. Look at Mozilla for example, it is written in C++ and is cross platform. |
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VBBR
Moderator
Brazil
617 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2004 : 4:28:21 PM
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Very clear. Thanks a lot for all your explaining here.
(of course anyone can post more arguments ) |
Whatever. Who knows... |
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Lachlan87
Moderator
USA
160 Posts |
Posted - Apr 28 2004 : 5:41:16 PM
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Yes, it would be more accurate to say that .Net was intended to be platform independant. Right now you can't even count on a windows machine to have it---which brings me to the point of this post: You asked if you should write HEX in VB6 or VB.NET. Much as I like VB.NET, I would recommend you use VB6. Although more and more people have the .net runtimes, I get the impression that those who do are still in the minority.
Of course, if you don't care if only a half dozen people play your game. . . |
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Is it needed to learn C++?
